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It's not easy being green (bring your green stuff woes here) TEETH

Discussion in 'Painting and Converting' started by Rikard, May 24, 2015.

  1. Rikard
    Bastiladon

    Rikard Well-Known Member

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    To stop the sticky I made in the Lizardman discussion from getting too full and hard to navigate for everyone I figured I'd start a topic here.

    The purpose of this thread is in a similar vein to the other one, but rather than me lead the topic, this one is here for you, basically post stuff here...
    • If you want a critique (let me know what you'd like, Minimal, Display cabinet or cast quality).
    • If you're thinking of a scratch build or conversion and want some advice.
    • If you're after some help with design ideas/places to look for inspiration.
    • If you have photos or stages of what you're doing and want some help.
    • If you want kit bash advice (such as parts to use) for a model you're doing.
    • If you want anatomical advice.

    So ask away, just bear in mind a complete scratch build question is very likely not going to be something I can help with, it would take too long.


    I keep seeing a lot of potential in the questions people on here ask and the way you approach conversions, ideas and scratch builds, I am positive that many of you sell yourselves WAY too short in your abilities and I really want to do more to help. :)
     
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  2. Crowsfoot
    OldBlood

    Crowsfoot Well-Known Member

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    Ok I will go first, I'd like to do dark elf cold one with old blood and maybe some others, which kits would you use for the rider?
     
  3. Rikard
    Bastiladon

    Rikard Well-Known Member

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    Hmm, much of that comes down to personal preference.


    However, for ease of converting I'd make use of plastic or fine cast (yes...even finecast) over metal, it's easier and quicker to cut and shape.

    I'd first off take the saddle from the plastic cold ones, you could even spend a bit more cash by stalking the ebay auctions to pick up the scar vet on cold one with the skaven saddle.
    [​IMG]

    Next I'd use the carno lord, you've got numerous bits you can cut and shape to fit on a saddle for the cold one, this includes the legs (I'd go so far as to stick the legs on the saddle first, before attaching them to the body). It will be easier to fill in the gaps between the legs and body with the green stuff, rather than try to fit the body around the saddle.

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2015
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  4. neveroddoreven
    Chameleon Skink

    neveroddoreven Well-Known Member

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    Hi Rkard.
    I've been sculpting unaided for about 15 years or so. I've never looked at a tutorial or asked for help before, I always liked the hobby as a personal learning experience, the challenge of finding solutions to problems and new techniques. I'm not as narrow-minded as I used to be however, I enjoy sharing what I know, like you (I used to be one of those people who kept what I knew a secret as a way of feeling superior or something). So with the wisdom that comes with age I realise there's nothing wrong with asking for help, especially from someone who knows what they're doing.

    I'm not sure if you've seen anything I've sculpted. I can't really remember what I've ever posted either.
    Last year I got back into sculpting seriously for my new Daemon army, and I have a potential big (BIG) upcoming project too. I'd like to use this thread as an opportunity to solve a few problems I've never been able to figure out. My posts might be on the large side and full of pictures. Just thought I'd warn you (I don't want to make this thread about me).
     
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  5. Rikard
    Bastiladon

    Rikard Well-Known Member

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    I've not seen anything you've done, not beyond some small conversions.
    But by all means yes, please do. :)


    I used to be quiet with my advice too, mainly because the questions never come with quick answers, but I've always been up for helping, there's no benefit for keeping stuff learned to oneself, so that's why I've been pushing people quite a bit recently to sculpting.
     
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  6. Crowsfoot
    OldBlood

    Crowsfoot Well-Known Member

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    @Rikard, could you do a tool kit list of what you would recommend we begineers should sculpt with?
     
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  7. NIGHTBRINGER
    Slann

    NIGHTBRINGER Second Spawning

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    That's a good idea!
     
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  8. Rikard
    Bastiladon

    Rikard Well-Known Member

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    This is one of those questions I'm always hesitant on answering (pretty sure I've already posted a photo on here of the main ones I use).
    Main reason being is that different people have different styles (this is true whether they're new or advanced) and tools will heavily come in to that, the tools I use for one type of scale, could well be very different for someone else.

    Certain materials are good, so wood for example is good for spikes and pulling parts into points.
     
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  9. Crowsfoot
    OldBlood

    Crowsfoot Well-Known Member

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    I agree but for someone who has not done sculpting a run down of what tool does what would help alot, I have a metal set but have no idea which tool would help create what shape so I end up using a cocktail stick.
     
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  10. pendrake
    Skink Chief

    pendrake Well-Known Member

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    Sculpting tools:
    Can you link to the other post? (If I find it I will add a link to this post: save you the trouble)
     
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  11. NIGHTBRINGER
    Slann

    NIGHTBRINGER Second Spawning

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    I agree; I feel it would be very helpful for those of us who struggle with sculpting. A simple list/table of tools and some of their primary uses would be very helpful. I think such a list would provide a stable platform from which to grow and develop.
     
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  12. Rikard
    Bastiladon

    Rikard Well-Known Member

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    Ok then,

    I've reposted some of the photos from the sticky in the LM discussion thread.
    The good news is you really don't need many tools at all and all of them are cheap and easy to get hold of or even make.


    A brief run down is as follows, although now I come to type it, it's a little harder than I thought for trying to describe what each does.
    Specific tools include:
    • Wax 5 (small) in the very last photo on the left hand side, next to the scale I've sculpted.
    • Clay shapers (bullet and flat tip, always get the grey, or "firm" ones in size 0, they do pick up scratches and wear with time, so keep and eye on them).
    • Scalpel (not pictured), just a normal scalpel, the ones GW does will do just fine, though cheaper ones do exist, like clay shapers the blades wear out, some textures are best with a sharp blade other with a blunt one, but you can buy blade packets by the hundred online very cheaply.
    • Scalpel (No 15 blade), quite nice for hair, but thicker blade variations, or blunt No 15 blades produce a better result.
    • [​IMG]
    • Old paint brushes, been using these less than two years now, but discovered them when I made the two hand weapon lizardman for Felix, these are AMAZING tools as you can shape and style them how you like with sand paper and a little varnish (they work best as pointy tools).
    Some people don't like the sticky quality of GS, but I do, part of it involves knowing how to use it and this is where the actual material of the tool comes in.
    • WOOD based tools: best for spikes, rough textures, warmer room temps (green stuff becomes more sticky), more blue than yellow in the mix, wrinkles, rubbing across different green stuff areas to hide joins and thin areas like eye sockets.

    • METAL based tools: best when the GS is either harder, colder room temps (green stuff becomes less sticky), more yellow than blue in the mix, fine edges, fine detail, areas where a stronger indentation or mark is needed. NOTE: This applies, especially if the blade is sharp, avoid dragging it through the green stuff as it will pull and warp the material on either side of it.

    • SILICON based tools (Clay shapers): The very reason you don't hear me complain about the stickiness of green stuff, if you need large areas smoothed out (especially on things like armour), then a flat clay shaper will do the job with ease. If the temperature is hot and you've mixed too much yellow in that it DOES sticky to the shaper, simply put the GS to the side for 20 minutes then try again (and repeat if it keeps happening).
    As for Tool kits, a standard ebay kit will have pretty much everything you will need that you can't make. I have noticed though, that only dental tools have duel curved tool in the very last photo at the bottom on the right hand side (next to the wax five).

    Along with this, if you have a good file (I work as an apprentice electrician, the large files you get from wholesalers are excellent) you can actually adapt the heads of tools you don't use to make something more suitable, it's quite quick and easy too.
    [​IMG]


    FLAT tools: smoothing out areas.
    POINTY tools: Making pock marks (areas for sliding in teeth).
    EDGED tools: Adding groves, lines of detail, etc.

    AUT_1913_zps2ddcce09.jpg AUT_1929_zpsc4d37e83.jpg AUT_1932_zps0e4b2a3c.jpg AUT_1933_zpse8cf5aa3.jpg
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2015
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  13. NIGHTBRINGER
    Slann

    NIGHTBRINGER Second Spawning

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    AWESOME STUFF @Rikard ! Thank you very much for that. I would have never have thought of using wood tools for sculpting. All I've been using is metal and clay sharpers. It will be nice to have a new set of tools at my disposal.
     
  14. Rikard
    Bastiladon

    Rikard Well-Known Member

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    I can't claim full credit for that, I got the idea after a chat with a hideously good sculptor called Tim Miller, he uses wax and tends to do 6-12 inch figures, but he is phenomenally good and possibly far more blunt and sarcastic then me. ;)

    Wood tools are a nice way of making use of old paint brushes and their ability to use the stickiness of green stuff to full effect is what makes them so good.

    I personally think the best LM faces I've done to date have been with wooden tools.

    Non-wooden tool use.
    AUT_2022_zpse4eef69f.jpg Krox1SIDE_zps5bb65c98.jpg

    Wooden tool use.
    The biggest irony here being that the heads made with the help of wooden tools are actually smaller than the ones made without them.
    AUT_1827_zpsf1dc4713.jpg Profile_zps1d16a268.jpg AUT_2111.JPG
     
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  15. NIGHTBRINGER
    Slann

    NIGHTBRINGER Second Spawning

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    Wow... all your stuff is fantastic. But I think you are right that the heads made with the wooden tools are the best of the bunch.

    So what type of wooden tool heads do you find must useful. All sharpened to points? Or are other shapes useful too, similar to metal tools?
     
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  16. Rikard
    Bastiladon

    Rikard Well-Known Member

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    Just pointed ones, like the spiky one in the photo I posted, I have about 3 that I made, all pointy, but just to different extents.
     
  17. NIGHTBRINGER
    Slann

    NIGHTBRINGER Second Spawning

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    Excellent, they should be easy enough to make!
     
  18. pendrake
    Skink Chief

    pendrake Well-Known Member

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    A catalog of tools. Exactly what I was hoping for. Thanks.

    I have a few of those. @Rikard, have you ever tested bamboo? [[... eyes package of kabob skewers ...]]
     
  19. Rikard
    Bastiladon

    Rikard Well-Known Member

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    I think those would work just as well, file, sand them down and then seal them with some varnish.
     
  20. NIGHTBRINGER
    Slann

    NIGHTBRINGER Second Spawning

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    I've heard that @Scolenex is extremely familiar with the properties of bamboo.
     
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