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7th Ed. Magic Roundup Part 2 - Direct Damage Spells

Discussion in 'Lizardmen & Saurian Ancients Tactics' started by Caneghem, Sep 27, 2009.

  1. Caneghem
    Carnasaur

    Caneghem New Member

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    These are damage spells with generally fewer targetting restrictions. The disadvantage is the Slann cannot channel these through a skink. These are generally more diverse, so I won't be able to clump them up as easily as the magic missiles. I will give my own subjective ranking, but it is much harder to quantify what is better and worse in this case. Like before, I will evaluate all of these based on a Slann taking the lore, and with respect to the Slann being tucked into a unit of temple guard. Note that for Synergies I will account for mostly just Lizardmen magic items and Heavens magic, since you'll probably want a flying skink priest to aid your Slann. I'll start with what I see as least effective and go from there.

    EDIT: The targeting restrictions have been edited on some of these, thanks to Celticfire and Strewart for finding in the BRB that spells (not just magic missiles) can't be cast into combat unless specifically stated.

    Master of the Wood - 6+ - Unengaged enemy unit within 12", or 12" of woods, LOS - D6 str4, D6 str5 if at least partially in wood
    Not as terrible as it might first seem. It is in many cases like forked lightning, since if there is a forest anywhere in your enemy's deployment zone you can hit anything within 12" that you can see. The partially within the wood strength bonus is nice if you can get it, but if your opponent is careful he will just make sure he is more than 2 inches into the wood. If there are a decent number of forests on the table you may find this one pretty useful, for making the enemy nervous about how they use the woods.

    Synergies - Possibly war drum of Xahutec to march into better casting positions.

    Conflagration of Doom - 11+ - Unengaged enemy unit in LOS - D6 Str4 flaming + D6 for every time you beat opponent's roll
    This can effect anything the Slann sees, and so it has really great range. The big problem of course is that it relies hugely on luck to do big damage.. but it CAN do large amounts of damage. I might cast this early in a magic phase to try to draw out dispel dice, assuming I was not in position to make Burning Head worth casting. It's a spell that sounds a lot scarier than it is. I guess this might be best considered as the Lore of Fire's "sniping" spell since it has only LOS as it's target restriction and can potentially annihilate a unit in one go. The problem is more often than not, your opponent will win the "roll off", so it is not a very reliable damage dealer.

    Synergies - Portent of Far. Casting portent of far on the Slann's unit is a good idea when you have Lore of Fire, since you'll be rolling tons of dice for all those magic missiles. Re-rolling all 1's starts to add up.

    Wall of Fire - 12+ - 24" Unengaged enemy unit - Str 4 hit to entire front rank, if unit moves each model takes str 4 hit.
    If you are facing a ranked up "uber-unit", something for example that has 30+ models, it might be worth trying to cast this spell on it. Essentially it means they cannot move until they dispel the wall, which means burning power dice in their own magic phase. It also is great against ranged units since it will hit every model in that long front rank. Finally there are units which have no choice but to move in certain circumstances. Cast this on a frenzied block of troops and then charge bait them... watch as every model in the unit takes a str 4 hit and see the numbers of the unit dwindle. With its high casting cost and relatively short list of worthwhile targets, this becomes an ok sort of situational spell. Yet one more reason I love Focus of Mystery on the Slann, it just gives him the ability to cast situational spells once per game but mostly stick to the bread and butter of each lore. It should also be noted that this gains a little bit of flexibility since it does not require line of sight.

    Synergies - Portent of Far - If you're casting this at a line of 10 archers portent of far will serve you well.. and you'll likely have portent on the Slann when using Lore of Fire anyway. I don't think you'd get to reroll 1's if the enemy moves through the wall though, since that would happen in the next phase. Now if somehow they were made to panic in the shooting phase.... I think the rerolls would work for the damage they take when they move.

    Forked Lightning - 6+ - Unengaged enemy unit in LOS - D6 str4 hits
    This is kind of a neat little imitation magic missile. The D6 str4 magic missiles all cast on a 5+, this one goes off on 6+ but you get the added benefit of unlimited range. Not a bad tradeoff at all, and it makes for some very flexible damage application if used properly. You still need LOS... if only you had some sort of flying spellcaster...

    Synergies - The flying skink priest. With unlimited range on the spell, it's just a matter of landing in a spot that gives you a line of sight to your target.

    Master of Stone - 8+ - Unengaged enemy unit within 12", or 12" of stone feature, LOS - D6 str5, D6 str6 if at least partially in feature
    Well if your enemy has any hills that he's castling up on, this one is a nice solid damage spell for a pretty low casting cost. Consider a unit of Dwarf gunners on a hill with T4 and 5+ armor... this spell lets you wound on 2+. You'll even wound warmachines on a 5+.. crazier things have happened than wiping out the machine itself. I've had one wiped out by a single D6 str4 magic missile. Great spell for someone entrenched on a hill. Not so great with no hills or stone features on the table.

    Synergies - Portent of Far (surprise). You'll be wounding on 2+ usually, might as well reroll those few 1's into actual wounds.

    Uranon's Thunder Bolt - 9+ - Unengaged enemy unit in LOS - D6 str4 hits no armor save
    Big brother of forked lightning, cast this on those pricey units of enemy knights. The more armor your target has, the better! Like forked lightning, it has unlimited range, so it is a very flexible spell. Considering the relatively low number of hits, it may only be worth casting at relatively expensive troops with lots of armor. In most cases though, you'll have something worth hitting with this spell.

    Synergies - Flying skink priest, he can fly to good LOS positions and to spots where he can see characters etc. Portent of Far might be worth it with this spell (say you are planning to set off your rod of storms). You may have only 3 or 4 rolls to wound with this, but each wound counts for a lot more since after that there are no armor saves. Against a key target you may wish to use Second Sign of Amul to help reroll as well.

    The Burning Head - 8+ - everything in a line of 18" - Str4 flaming hits as cannon, panic check for one casualty
    This is actually really good, 18" is one heck of a long cannon ball bounce. The obvious downside is you'll always be pegging one or sometimes two of your TG, but they are pretty resilient and you should weigh this very small risk against possible benefits. Look at the bright side, at least you don't have to take a panic check! I'm not entirely sure you can even cast this while your TG are in combat, because that would be hitting models engaged in close combat. It should also be noted that the panic check isn't redundant with the one from salamanders, as theirs occurs in the shooting phase. 8+ to cast isn't exceptionally high, considering you will probably only cast this when it will net you lots of hits and a couple panic checks.

    Synergies - Portent of Far, War Drum of Xahutec - have the war drum tucked somewhere in your TG, and you'll be able to set up some truly spectacular shots with the template, hitting whole lines of enemies, etc. Don't forget the panic checks! A foolish opponent may underestmate the ability of the TG to march up parallel to a line of light cav. Blast 6 automatic hits at str4 on them with this spell and possibly enemies on the other side, then watch the carnage ensue. You can never make the enemy take enough panic checks.

    Pit of Shades - 12+ - 24" Unengaged enemy unit LOS - Small round template 4+ partials to hit, those effected take initiative test or die
    Well this one is a good bit of fun in terms of shutting down enemy warmachines and even big lumbering models with low initiative. Even the dreaded War Hydra has only an initiative of 2. The Pit of Shades will need to roll that 4+ partial hit to have a shot at the big old hydra.. but after that there is a 2/3 chance of the big beastie going away for good. No saves of ANY kind are allowed against this beast of a spell. Of course warmachines fall right in, as they can't even test for their initiative. The ability to just kill things instantly is a nice perk, and casting this against a large block of expensive temple guard or dwarf hammerers is going to wreak some serious havoc. This is another situational spell though, and there will be times when it is not worth casting. Fortunately Lore of Shadows is rife with other good choices if there's nothing big and slow that needs instant killing.

    Synergies - Can't think of any offhand, the spell doesn't need any help really. Would be nice if the 4+ partial roll was considered a "to hit" roll. The War Drum of Xahutec may help you get the Slann and TG into better position.

    Rule of Burning Iron - 5+ - Enemy model within 24", LOS - Does a hit against a single enemy model, based on AS of target, no armor save for target
    Everybody knows this spell, it is your textbook character sniper. With this spell at your disposal, enemy characters are no longer safe inside their units. Picking out single knight models is worth the points as well, especially enemy unit champions. A great spell to be sure. Be careful when facing dwarves though, they can take the "Rune of the Furnace" for only 5 points that makes them immune to purely flaming attacks, which this spell is. You may also find yourself facing armies who have characters with low armor saves, so you'll be stuck plinking off single knights and such. This spell also negates the EotG ward save bubble, since the Slann is actually just heating up the target's armor and not "throwing" anything at the target. Thus "direct damage" and not "magic missile". Little skink doesn't stand a chance!

    Synergies - Portent of Far, Bane Head - Nothing better than one-shot sniping the enemy's 1+ armor save BSB! Bane head makes sure that one wound doubles and kills the target. The portent of far just makes darn sure you get him. Even a str7 hit will fail to wound 1/6 times. Portent of far pushes that to 1/36.

    The Spirit of the Forge - 12+ - Unengaged enemy Unit 24" LOS - 2D6 hits, strength determined as with Rule of Burning Iron
    This one is a cav crusher every time, yielding an average kill total of 5.83 wounds (6.81 with portent of far active). Also watch out with Brettonians, as the high strength is enough to set off their 5+ ward save, knocking this back to 3.89 (4.54) kills on average. Still really really good mind you, but they will be a bit more resilient. Other great models to crush with this spell are treemen and big monsters with a good armor save. As with the Rule of Burning Iron, you'll want to make sure your opponent has models with decent armor save, or you may want to consider another lore.

    Synergies - Portent of Far, Bane Head - Portent of far is great anytime you will be wounding on a 2+, because rerolling 1's in that case means you are rerolling ALL failed wounds. Bane head in the case of a treeman ancient... Remember the recent Lizardman FAQ concerning how to deal with doubling wounds with the piranha blade and the bane head? The same will probably apply to bane head and a flammable target. Cast this at the Treeman Ancient with the bane head on him, and he takes 4 multiplied wounds per actual wound. Juicy.

    Steal Soul - 8+ - Any enemy model within 12" - Target takes a wound with no armor save, caster gains wound
    What a great spell! No rolling to wound is phenomenal. Burning Iron is ok for sniping high armored characters, but this one doesn't even need Line of Sight, and wounds any target regardless of armor AND TOUGHNESS. It is great because it is guaranteed damage unless they have a ward or regen save. The 12" range is a limitation, as otherwise this would probably be overpowered. The 12" range also means you should plan to march your Temple Guard into the thick of combat, so be sure to take your likely targets into account. Remember you don't need line of sight either, so enemy units containing characters will be hesitant to charge your TG block.

    Synergies - Bane Head, War Drum of Xahutec. The Drum in the TG unit will help you close the gap with your intended enemy character target. The Bane Head lets you double wounds against the target, though I'm not sure your Slann would gain 2 wounds (not that it matters that much).

    Well, that's 11 more spells done. 20/48 spells complete! Part 3 will be shorter, as I will cover the last type of damage spell.. radial damage spells.
     
  2. strewart
    OldBlood

    strewart Well-Known Member

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    Wow. Really good review. Are you going to do a summary of the lores as a whole at the end? Great work.

    One question though, has it been FAQed or confirmed that warmachines auto-fall into pit of shades? Sounds very good, and I can see opponents trying to argue against it.

    It seems really obvious, but I never considered the possibility of throwing portent onto the slann for his magic phase. Definitely makes a magic army a lot more tempting. Keep up the good work!
     
  3. Celticfire
    Chameleon Skink

    Celticfire New Member

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    I dont think that you can cast eithe rof the Lightning bolts into combat. Unless the descrition say that the spell can be cast into combat i don't think that i can.
     
  4. Caneghem
    Carnasaur

    Caneghem New Member

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    Well the book says that only magic missiles follow the rules for shooting, as in no shooting into combats. Since none of these are magic missiles, I just went by the exact wording they used for targeting restrictions. If it has been FAQ'd somewhere I will have to amend the guide, but after reading through the Big Rulebook and both FAQ's for it, it has not mentioned it anywhere.
     
  5. Caneghem
    Carnasaur

    Caneghem New Member

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    I'll probably do a summary of the lores at the end, in light of the full review of all the spells. As for pit of shades, I can say that yes warmachines do always fall in. I started as a dwarf player, and while it never happened to me, I have seen lots of organ guns and the like fall into the pit (via battle reports). Now if you can't fully cover the warmachine with the template, then you would still have to roll the 4+ partial hit. But the big rule book is very clear that if a model has a 0 in any stat, it automatically fails checks on that stat. I think the Empire Steam Tank has immunity from this spell though. Certain other things like the anvil of doom and cauldron of blood that are described as "indestructible" are also immune to Pit of Shades.
     
  6. strewart
    OldBlood

    strewart Well-Known Member

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    Yeah that makes sense. I was just wondering where the logic about warmachines was, but it does say if you have a zero you auto fail.

    Also, I agree about targetting. Spells can be cast into combat except for magic missiles unless they specifically say they cannot, and the lightning ones have no such wording.

    Edit: If you didn't notice, the magic threads are in the index now. ;)
     
  7. Caneghem
    Carnasaur

    Caneghem New Member

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    That's a good idea, having a tactica directory. I'll be sure to get cracking on the next one before too long here.. I think I have "buff" spells up next.
     
  8. Celticfire
    Chameleon Skink

    Celticfire New Member

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    Our play style is that if it isn't in the RB then you can't do it. it saves alot of Arguments were people argue "but it dosent say i can't do this!"
     
  9. Caneghem
    Carnasaur

    Caneghem New Member

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    I know what you are saying, but then why would they create a whole class of spells called magic missiles? Wouldn't they have just said "ALL spells can't hit units in combat unless specifically stated"? You will notice also that among the direct damage spells, Wall of Fire and Pit of Shades actually specify that you can't cast into combat... and for good reason! Imagine you just got off a charge in your movement phase that will result almost certainly in the enemy breaking from combat. If you cast Wall of Fire on them, when they break they will be forced to move through the fire and take an additional str 4 hit per model. That would make the spell a bit too poweful I think.. so they disallowed combat casting.
     
  10. Eternity_Warden
    Terradon

    Eternity_Warden New Member

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    You just gave me a great idea, cast wall of fire on an enemy unit you want to charge next turn. Then the unit must either stay where it is and get charged on your next turn or else take the fire damage. Or dispel it, thus making it easier for you to get other spells through...

    Okay maybe it's just a mediocre idea. And unoriginal. I've just never used fire magic before...
     
  11. strewart
    OldBlood

    strewart Well-Known Member

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    Nah that has potential, use the spell to effectively pin a unit in place while you setup a flank charge. Basically if the charge is any good your opponent will probably take the fire damage instead and risk losing half the unit than being flanked and chased down but its a good way to force them to move and take fire damage.
     
  12. Caneghem
    Carnasaur

    Caneghem New Member

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    Of course, if your Terradons aren't too terribly busy, just land them in the path of the target unit's escape.

    Oh and you can also wipe out units using the Scar Vet with Jag Charm, just keep him near where you think the enemy will be when they flee your charges. Magic phase rolls around, and if they fail to dispel his flying movement, he should be able to bag a unit himself.

    A more unconventional and perhaps slightly insane trick is to use your flying skink priest as a sacrifice for the greater good. It has to be a really juicy charge for this to work...

    Basically the charge to end all charges is lined up and you are pretty sure you are at the very edge of your charge range (say a flank charge with a unit of Saurus into a main enemy unit with a character and banner. Your opponent knows he is going to lose the fight with your flank charge and possibly be run down.

    You declare the charge and then your little solo skink priest who can fly also declares a charge against the same unit. Well, now the opponent has to take the charge from the original unit, because with a 20" charge range the flying skink priest will almost certainly catch them and destroy them in the most embarassing manner imaginable. So the poor priest will expose himself to a few attacks and possibly be killed... but should he survive, he's one more unit to pursue, and at a mighty 3D6!

    Again, make sure the unit you are trying to take down is worth more than the priest (usually 150 points) and/or has a banner or characters, so that it is worth the points if you lose your priest. Who says mages shouldn't be in combat?

    Again, this is assuming your terradons are elsewhere occupied. Though you can use the same trick with a depleted unit of Terradons who are below US5.
     
  13. strewart
    OldBlood

    strewart Well-Known Member

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    I get the rest of it ok, and combining a charge with a flier is a pretty awesome idea so they can't try to escape, but how is the jag charm scar vet going to help? If they choose to flee rather than fighting, he will only pursue 8", do you mean he in the magic phase charges a unit that is already fleeing to keep them fleeing or catch and kill them?
     
  14. Caneghem
    Carnasaur

    Caneghem New Member

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    Right, it's just one more flying charge you can make, and it happens at a time in your turn where everything has already fled the charges they were going to flee initially, and now you have a 20" charger coming from out of nowhere to destroy the ones who thought they got away. If you like to play the flying Scar Vet deep into enemy territory, there is a decent chance that once it gets to the point of the main line charging and causing enemies to flee, the Scar Vet's Steed of Shadows charge will at least cause the enemies already fleeing to run back toward your line once again, if not catch them outright. Since you move your terradons into crossfire position after charges have been resolved in the movement phase, you can align them perfectly so that when the Scar Vet does his magic charge the enemy always flees into the terradons. Just another good synergy.
     
  15. strewart
    OldBlood

    strewart Well-Known Member

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    Yeah that is pretty good actually. Damn, so tempting. :p My armies are going to be character heavy enough as it is though...

    Just because I will probably forget to check by the time I get home tonight, if a fleeing unit is charged they don't get to try to rally they just keep fleeing right?
     
  16. Caneghem
    Carnasaur

    Caneghem New Member

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    Yep, they declare a flee reaction automatically, and turn and flee directly away from the charger. Unless they have some special rule stating otherwise.

    The game is won in the movement phase... but when does the movement phase really end? I'm currently working on a Slann list that has a very Tomb Kings feel to how it plays, and I'll primarily take Lore of Shadow. I think it's going to be pretty fun to play with. Coincidentally enough, my army is going to be desert themed anyhow.
     
  17. Celticfire
    Chameleon Skink

    Celticfire New Member

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    From long long ago we talked about these spells not being cast into combat. To answer your question about the reason for making magic missles. here is my answer- they are just more restrictive than normal spells.
    here is a question for you.
    Why are certain spells designated for being able to cast into combat while others are not?
     
  18. strewart
    OldBlood

    strewart Well-Known Member

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    And why are some spells designated as not being allowed to be cast into combat and others not? Some say yes, some say no, what about the ones that say nothing? Hmm I am sure we are not the only ones to have considered and discussed this, I will have to do a bit of research.
     
  19. Celticfire
    Chameleon Skink

    Celticfire New Member

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    I think the spirit of the rule was that because there are not likly to be neat rows of guyd in combat, that you would not want to fire at a unit for fear of hitting your own guys. hence the skavens "life is cheap" rule. i realize the rule is for shooting but the same reasoning applies.
     
  20. Caneghem
    Carnasaur

    Caneghem New Member

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    Let me know if you turn anything up, but after reading through the 7th edition BRB and the two subsequent FAQs, I can see no reason why non-magic missiles would abide by the rule of not hitting things in combat.

    The reasoning is fairly simple as I see it. A magic missile is an actual bolt of harmful energy that travels from the caster to his intended target. In this case the mage would certainly not risk throwing that spell into a close combat, no matter how accurately he thinks he can throw it.

    Direct damage spells (my name for them), on the other hand, do not travel from the caster to the target. Forked lightning and Uranon's Thunderbolt come down from the heavens, thus the reason there is no range limitation. Spirit of the Forge just heats up the armor of your enemies, not friendlies and the wizard isn't actually "throwing" anything at the enemy, just heating up their armor. The are exceptions, like Pit of Shades and Wall of Fire which specify they can't be targeted at enemies engaged in combat. You wouldn't open up a Pit of Doom underneath your own troops and you wouldn't bring a blazing wall of flame to life underneath them either, thus the restriction.
     

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