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AoS Tactics for upcomming tournament with Thunderquake

Discussion in 'Seraphon Tactics' started by IggyStarhost, Mar 14, 2019.

  1. IggyStarhost
    Temple Guard

    IggyStarhost Active Member

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    Hi Guys,

    End of this month I have a tournament coming up. And already have the missions available.
    Which gives me loads of time to fantasize and plan my battles. I'd like to share with you, and curious about your thoughts on the tactics.

    My list:

    Allegiance: Seraphon
    Mortal Realm: Shyish

    Leaders
    Slann Starmaster (260)
    - General
    - Trait: Great Rememberer
    - Artefact: Incandescent Rectrices
    Saurus Astrolith Bearer (160)
    Engine of the Gods (220)
    - Artefact: Ethereal Amulet

    Battleline
    10 x Skinks (60)
    - Meteoric Javelins & Star Bucklers
    10 x Skinks (60)
    - Boltspitters & Star Bucklers
    10 x Skinks (60)
    - Boltspitters & Star Bucklers

    Units
    3 x Kroxigor (160)
    4 x Razordons (160)
    3 x Ripperdactyl Riders (140)

    Behemoths
    Bastiladon (280)
    Bastiladon (280)

    Battalions
    Thunderquake Starhost (120)

    Endless Spells
    Balewind Vortex (40)

    Total: 2000 / 2000
    Extra Command Points: 1
    Allies: 0 / 400
    Wounds: 102


    Mission 1 (note, wrong map displayed, we use the normal Escalation map, map of mission 3)
    Schermafbeelding 2019-03-14 om 15.20.00.png

    My thoughts:

    Deployment:

    This one is though with the thunderquake my Bastiladons have to start way in the back. I believe the EotG isn't a behemoth. And I need to put my skinks on the 9" line. So really hope to avoid a deepstrike army.
    So skinks on the 9" line spread out evenly, Basti's on the 24" line, and the rest on the 18" line. I think to put the rippers on one flank, and the razordons on the other flank. Since the rippers can catch up with the skinks, and the razordons have a threat range of 20". Which could help on the decreasing the amount of models on the objective. The rest wil be put on the center, hiding behind the EotG and near the Krox for LoS.
    I think I still want to go second (each game is a roll of, who finished deployment first wins ties), since I cant score points in the first battle round, and want to have the double turn initiative.
    My plan is to hopefully teleport both basti's to the front in range of the center objective, but in the probable range of the EotG and Astrolith for the buff. And wont use the balewind on t1, so my slann can also move forward and keepup with the EotG (I shouldnt run right?), to be safely in the deathstar later. With aprox 12-15 CCP I think I'll just keep on pumping out skinks. Maybe a second unit of rippers, if I run out of skinks (I have 70 in total, 30 on the field).
    Although Aqshy has some nice spells aswel. Especially Inferno Blades (see below) sounds fun on the rippers. With the balewind, astrolith and channeling through the EotG the slann has a huge range.

    My few doubts are:
    - Go first or second?
    - Should I run?
    - Is the EotG a Behemoth?
    - Should I focus on all 3 objectives? Or just thunderquake on the middle one, and rippers/skinks/razordons on a other one, too just effectively hold 2 of the 3 objectives.


    Schermafbeelding 2019-03-14 om 15.47.10.png





    Schermafbeelding 2019-03-14 om 15.20.11.png

    This one I have less concerns about. I think i'll put the thunderquake on the home objective, but in range to shoot to the other 2 objectives. Put one unit of skinks in the back to zone out my rear. And send skinks+rippers to one side, and skinks+krox to the other side. And razordons in the middle. In range of the Astro and in range of one, or both middel objectives to clear some body's. Here also pump out skinks with CCP. But maybe sneak in some chameleon skinks on turn 3. So they can vanish on turn 4 and reappear on t5 to snatch their home objective, if not guarded with many wounds. With the slann probably cast a spell each turn. Curse of rust seems really nice. Also some nice other mortal wound spells available if needed.


    Schermafbeelding 2019-03-14 om 16.02.36.png




    Schermafbeelding 2019-03-14 om 15.20.21.png

    This one could be tricky aswel. Thinking about grabbing the middle one with the EotG and the deathstar. But what about the other ones? The astro needs to stay close to the TQ. But dont really want to expose the slann.
    I a grab and hold one objective for 5 turns I gross 15 points. I would just have to removes his hero's from the other objectives consistently, or let him hold for max 2 turns. Bestial Spirit and Flock of doom could help me push out some mortal wounds. To manage this. Also highly depends on the opponent.
    Maybe I do push the slann out, but bubblewrap him and summon an Eternity warden turn 1.


    Doubts:
    - Does a teleport counts as a move? Or is it only: move, run, charge, retreat? Or just move.
    - Go for one objective or for two?
    - Should I take the middle one?
    - Go first or second?

    Love to hear your thoughts! And I'll try to make tons of photos for a battle report.

    Schermafbeelding 2019-03-14 om 16.02.47.png

     
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  2. ILKAIN
    Razordon

    ILKAIN Well-Known Member

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    Wow that's comprehensive. I am at work and unable to comment on all of it at this time, however I would say that the kroxigors are not worth the points, and YES an EoTG is both a leader AND a Behemoth slot.
     
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  3. LizardWizard
    Carnasaur

    LizardWizard Grand Skink Handler Staff Member

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    I shall help with in depth analysis in a bit, got some things I need to do first.
     
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  4. IggyStarhost
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    IggyStarhost Active Member

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    Thanks! I see it counts in the wascroll builer as a Behemoth, so thats a pitty. What is the actual ruling on behemoth? Hard to recognize what a behemoth is. It doenst have the keyword. And some Behemoths arent monsters. Is a monster always a behemoth?
     
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  5. ILKAIN
    Razordon

    ILKAIN Well-Known Member

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    actual ruling is whatever the generals handbook says they count as.
     
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  6. IggyStarhost
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    IggyStarhost Active Member

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    Oh thanks! That makes it very clear! Guess it makes my razordons artillery than. Bummer
     
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  7. ILKAIN
    Razordon

    ILKAIN Well-Known Member

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    They are indeed, which means 4 units of 4 each max. of course that will cost you 640 pts, and 480 (us) dollars.
     
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  8. Killer Angel
    OldBlood

    Killer Angel Prophet of the Stars Staff Member

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    Be aware that with the thunderquake, you must include also a unit of skink handlers. I don't see it in your list. ;)
     
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  9. IggyStarhost
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    IggyStarhost Active Member

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    The Krox are in the battalion. Rerolls for 3 razors + handlers has aprox the same dmg output of 4 razors. And Krox gerolling hit/wounds/saves and heal (is it 3 or 1 wound?) make them kinda okay.
     
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  10. Killer Angel
    OldBlood

    Killer Angel Prophet of the Stars Staff Member

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    Ah, ok. Makes sense. ;)
     
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  11. IggyStarhost
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    IggyStarhost Active Member

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    Got some sweet advice for me? :)
     
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  12. LizardWizard
    Carnasaur

    LizardWizard Grand Skink Handler Staff Member

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    Sorry, got busy helping clubmates theorycraft and plan their list for an event on the 23rd.

    Thunderquake loves the early double turn when it can get it. You will be out of range to shoot anything you really care about in most turn one battleplans. Also, EotG is an behemoth. Your list centers around focus fire. So pick your targets wisely. Save your Kroxigor until the enemy has engaged you and use them are a counter attack to thin hordes or kill off backfield deepstrikes.

    Escalation will be the hardest battleplan for you. You definitely want to go second when possible. Don't forget about inferno blades on your Rippers. Also incandescent form can help keep your slann safer. Try to stay in your deployment zone and turtle for the first few rounds of shooting. Once you have softened up your opponent you should be able to invade with your rippers and hit them where they are weakened. This battleplan is normally played for the late game.

    Battle for the Pass is one of Seraphon's best maps. Hold your own and at least one if not bother of the center objectives for a long as possible. Use skink Screens to block charges, send your rippers to tie up enemy fast cav, and try to keep a small point lead. If things go well your oppoent will have to thin their backfield to uproot from the center and then you can LoSaT units near his rear objective. Rain of Lead can help you slow the enemy advance towards the center objective you control. And don't forget about Curse of Rust. Always try to cast it on your opponent's tarpit or main threat.

    Three places of power is a race to assassinate heroes. Get your heroes on objective early and put everything into killing the enemy heroes. I have won this battleplan turn one on multiple occasions, however not with thunderquake. Alternatively turtle up on the center objective and try to pick off any enemy heroes that approach the flanking objectives. If your opponent brings monsters don't forget about Cower. This spell has resulted in people throwing dice at me.
     
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  13. IggyStarhost
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    IggyStarhost Active Member

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    Thanks alot for your indepth! I’ve never played with realm spell before. I now love the slann even more!

    Going over the rulespack. I noticed there is nog major/minor win. You devide matchpoints depending on your point difference. Which I find a bummer. I love to know my win condition and just win by a few points on controlling the lead. Not a too risky approach for much victorypoints.

    Any advice? Should I ‘go big or go home’ or just go for controle?
    DE9519EC-4918-4A2A-BFB7-01821D6E06BA.jpeg
     
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  14. LizardWizard
    Carnasaur

    LizardWizard Grand Skink Handler Staff Member

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    If you want to win the whole event you not only need to get major victories for all your games you also need to get a significant lead. All events run things a bit differently. I haven't seen the table your event is using before.
     
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  15. IggyStarhost
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    IggyStarhost Active Member

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    I think the Shadowstrike would be better for an all or nothing tournament like this. But i’ll stick to thunderquake. I dont get to play a lot of 2k games and prefer to play shadowstrike at 1k.
    So my hopes are too win 2 of the 3 games and end in the top half. Top position isnt really achieveable since I do miss out on alot of painting point because I cant fully paint all the summoning models.
     
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  16. IggyStarhost
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    IggyStarhost Active Member

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    While I think about it. The distance for escalation isn’t that big of a problem. Below is based on my going 2nd in T2.
    For my opponent to grab the objective, he need to be within 6”. With me starting 24” behind, I need to close a 30” gap with the bastiladons.
    Thats 2 times the movement + the range of the solar engines. I could run them on t1 for some extra inches. Not really worried about mortal wounds on a run of 6+, with the 4+ save and the healing. But not sure if unesecarry risk.
    If I take the gamble of teleporting, I’m sure i’ll miss one. Then I would need to succesfully teleport it next turn. Dont like that odds.

    If I want to shoot with the razordons T2, I need to atleast close the 30” gap. 2 times movement +range sums up to 28”. If my opponent is smart enough. He would take the objective, but stay out of range. I could run them turn 1. But potentially losing 1 makes me not want to risk that. I could use the T1 teleport for them. If succesfull I could get in range of the opponent and shoot. And screen them with skinks in the movement phase. If not succesfull, I could try again T2.

    The other teleport I could used for EotG to get it in range for the Azure Bolt, in case I roll 6-9.
    I could also just move 8” T1 do be in range for T2. But I think I’ll risk the teleport. But if I miss it
    I would need to make it next turn. If I fail both, but can roll for teleport, that would be okay aswell.

    With teleport:
    66% chance for t1 en t2 in range
    22% chance for t2 in range
    11% chance for not in range T1 en T2

    With no teleport I could just be in range T2.
    So with teleport only 11% chance of a worse result.

    With that all combined I have:
    - 66% chance to shoot T1 with razordons
    - 22% chance to shoot T2 with razordons
    - Same for the Engine of the Gods
    - 0% to shoot with basti’s T1
    - almost gauranteed shooting with basti if opponent goes for center objective.

    If I’d try to teleport the basti’s t1. I would forgo good chance of shooting with razors and pass on the possible Azure Bolt from the EotG.
    If I’m correct I also couldnt make them swift or savage the first turn.

    The basti’s could possibly only get in range T2 by themselfs if I go second. If I do go first the second battleround, I could always try to teleport them than.

    I do really want to go second on T2.
    So if the choice is mine, should I go first T1, to win the ties for the T2 rollof. Or not risk in getting doubleturned. Ofcourse depending on the army Im facing.
     
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  17. LizardWizard
    Carnasaur

    LizardWizard Grand Skink Handler Staff Member

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    Yeah, going first isn't an auto lose. However, you have a lot more options going second here.
     
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  18. Killer Angel
    OldBlood

    Killer Angel Prophet of the Stars Staff Member

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    BTW, if you're interested, in this thread I've made a couple of BatReps with Thunderquake.
     
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  19. IggyStarhost
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    IggyStarhost Active Member

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    Thanks! Was a really nice read! Why did you pick those artifacts and not others?
     
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  20. Killer Angel
    OldBlood

    Killer Angel Prophet of the Stars Staff Member

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    My lists tend to rely on Slann, so it's survival is mandatory; the Gryph-feather Charm is amongst the best defensive items available.
    Playing a thunderquake, is also vital to keep the EotG in play as long as possible, so the rectrices are a good pick.

    I usually tend to favor defensive items that protect my key units, rather than offensive ones (unless I'm fielding a oldblood on carno and I've got a second relic slot tnx to a battalion)
     
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