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9th Age Salamanders and 3'' templates

Discussion in 'Lizardmen & Saurian Ancients Tactics' started by airjamy, Jan 12, 2016.

  1. airjamy
    Razordon

    airjamy Active Member

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    Hi all! When i first read the 9th age rules i was surprised that Sallies got buffed. They seemed to get cheaper, with better missfires, while being a lot more reliable and with more range, and they are cheaper! The devil is in the details though, using the 3'' template instead of the flame template is a big nerf. Do people still think it is viable, or only against specific armies such as Elves? What do people think about the poison spitting goodness, i though it looked good against Knights, but it is very unreliable with its 5+ rolls needed. I have only played against elves in 9th, and only with fire sallies, which went pretty well, but that is to be expected. What are other peoples experiences?
     
  2. n810
    Slann

    n810 First Spawning

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    wat.... they use the small round template now ? :confused:
     
  3. protector
    Temple Guard

    protector Active Member

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    last time I read their rules you hit everything the template passes over not just what it ends on, which is another buff but I could be wrong.

    but after using spearbacks sallies will have to be awesome for me to use them because those spearbacks are nuts
     
  4. themuffinman873
    Chameleon Skink

    themuffinman873 Member

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    The 3" template traveling 5" (the max) has the potential to hit more targets than a flame template ever would. On the flipside, traveling 1" has less potential. The maximum potential range has also decreased from 10"+7" (the previous max) to 8"+5", but we sacrifice potential max distance for reliability, so overshooting is not a problem anymore. Poison does not sound like that great of an option, as was noted that they would work well against cav, they are much less reliable to aim, and therefore you are less likely to hit the small cav target (small relative to an infantry block).

    I think the sallies are still viable against pretty much every army (with the exception of Ogres).
     
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  5. The Hunted
    Carnasaur

    The Hunted Active Member

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    The 9th age Salamanders really require you to get in the face of the enemy unit, otherwise they just fall short. I always like the fact that I could stay a reasonable distance away (where fleeing is very safe), and still be able to fire at enemy infantry.
    Now though, if you don't want to do a suicide shot; you have to get to a flank first and then shoot. Which is definetaly harder to pull of. If you do this though, you are very much rewarded with carnage.

    The spearbacks are more of a utility unit. Clearing out fast cavalry and being a fairly cheap, fast and annoying redirector. I do like them, but 1-2 Salamanders will always have their place in my army.

    The Hunted
     
  6. themuffinman873
    Chameleon Skink

    themuffinman873 Member

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    One alternative to suicide shots is that sallies can now count on being able to shoot at least 9" (8" base + at least 1" in the shot). This would allow you to wedge a spear block in between the sally and what you want dead. There must be a 1" spacing between spear block and enemy unit, as well as 1" between spear block and sally, so that leaves us with a potential block size of 7" deep. Our 25mm bases are just shy of an inch, so you could have a 7 rank spear block (way too big imo) and still get reliable shots (assuming you walk up for a point blank engagement). There are obviously some assumptions about movement going on, but the potential is huge.

    This is something we could have never done with old sallies.

    All that said, an 8th edition money shot with the flame template at max range feels so much more satisfying then anything in T9A.
     
  7. protector
    Temple Guard

    protector Active Member

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    I actually used spearbacks to destroy heavy Cavalry, with their sharp spikes and amount of shots two of them can take out a whole unit in 2-3 rounds.
     
  8. Pinktaco
    Skar-Veteran

    Pinktaco Vessel of the Old Ones Staff Member

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    Salamanders are really awesome (in theory). You can place the template within 8", so of you're close enough you can put it right on a flank and any inches it moves = units hit. It's more reliable.
    So the salamander will likely see a price increase.

    The spearbacks are likely getting hit with the back. It won't be long before people take 3x3 of these and they'll remove everything haha. An easy fix would be to put them in rare and the AP1 as an upgrade instead of AP2 in close range.
    This would mean you'd have to choose between AP1 or anti air. Currently it's a no brainer to just auto pick the anti air upgrade since it stacks with the AP1 on it's profiles. Imagine KoE peg knights getting hit on 4+, wounded on 3+ and only have 5+/6+ save. Even if they're skirmish they still get picked off easily. I'd imagine that a unit with 3 spearbacks could easily take care of them.
     
  9. The Hunted
    Carnasaur

    The Hunted Active Member

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    I have never used the spearbacks (yet), but I would not buy the hunter spikes as an upgrade. Yes, it would be absolutely awesome against Pegasus Knights. But I don't see that many fliers around, so it would be quite the waste.
    I would however buy the sharp spikes upgrade (AP2) for killing of knights more reliably and just...any small roaming unit basically.

    This is something I haven't thought about. But it is great!
    I think this is pretty easy to set up, the Salamander has to pick a spot where it cannot hit your own units but is in range of the enemy (of to the side, this becomes fairly easy). The saurus have to move up to where the enemy infantry unit cannot charge the Salamander without hitting said Saurus.

    In a 1 vs 1 this seems not hard at all. Problems arise with more units on the battlefield. Then you have to be much more carefull with the placement, but it still sounds awesome! I am going to use this to my advantage :punch:

    The Hunted
     
  10. airjamy
    Razordon

    airjamy Active Member

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    Yes, they do! I was very much surprised at this as well at the start, but they would be totally overpowered if that was the case. I am still not sure if you hit everything that the template has been ''dragged'' over, could someone clarify this? I think the beastie is fine when you only hit what you hit under the template tbh..
     
  11. Pinktaco
    Skar-Veteran

    Pinktaco Vessel of the Old Ones Staff Member

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    Unless they changed it in the recent update you're right @airjamy - everything the template passes over is touched.
     
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  12. Deusvult
    Chameleon Skink

    Deusvult Active Member

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    Has anyone giving the Venom Sallies a go?? I am quite keen on these (have not tested yet). Being a catapult that can move and shoot is nifty. I just thinking that these guys will be able to hit something mid-battleline and have some scatter fodder around, let alone rolling a hit. I know that Fire Sallies have a potential to hit more, but 18" range means first turn shooting.
     
  13. airjamy
    Razordon

    airjamy Active Member

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    If the mighty Pinktaco says so, i will burn my enemies with unholy vengeance! I have played them already without the dragging rule, and they felt a lot weaker, but still ok. Glad to see that the are a bit stronger then i thought.

    I have not given the venom sallies a go, i think they are to random for what they bring, but if someone can talk about this with experience, that would be cool.
     
  14. Pinktaco
    Skar-Veteran

    Pinktaco Vessel of the Old Ones Staff Member

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    It's quite filthy if you get within the 8". You can place the template on a unit and anything it passes over is just a bonus :3
     
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  15. Deusvult
    Chameleon Skink

    Deusvult Active Member

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    So I just played again with some venom sallies.
    Not an ideal match up versing Ogres.

    I was not disappointed. They protected the flank of my skink high chief and his unit, and killed/wounded some ogres. The nearly constant 5's to wound work really well, especially with heavens.

    I will be keen to get these guys out against something with 20/25mm bases. These guys are going to stay in my list for now, to see what else they can achieve.
     
  16. NIGHTBRINGER
    Slann

    NIGHTBRINGER Second Spawning

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    Better try them soon, from what I've heard the venom version will eliminated in the next 9th Age update.
     
  17. Deusvult
    Chameleon Skink

    Deusvult Active Member

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    So "nu",
    What do you know?
     
  18. NIGHTBRINGER
    Slann

    NIGHTBRINGER Second Spawning

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    I got the info from this video review (I got the link directly from the 9th age site). He speaks about the Salamander/Razordon at around 6:20.
     
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  19. Deusvult
    Chameleon Skink

    Deusvult Active Member

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    Oh well that sucks balls. Less options less fun.
     
  20. NIGHTBRINGER
    Slann

    NIGHTBRINGER Second Spawning

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    Sadly it seems like there will be far less options. The Salamanders/Razordons don't bug me too much, but reducing our already pitiful core selection is simply a horrendous crime.
     
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